HT024 – ButtKicker and My Shaking Couch
Episode #204
Host: Mike Deckys
Guest: Mark Luden – President and CEO – Guitammer Company www.thebuttkicker.com
Topic: The Buttkicker – a silent subwoofer
Download Full Transcript here
On this episode of the Smarter Home Theater Show we welcome Mark Luden. Mark is the President and CEO of the Guitammer Company. The Guitammer Company is the parent company that is responsible for the Buttkicker. For those of you in the home theater realm you are probably familiar with what this is, but if you are not stay tuned and we are going to find out. So I would like to take the opportunity and welcome you to the show Mark.
Mark: Glad to be here Mike. Thank you very much.
Mike: Thank you. Now besides a cool sounding name can you give us an idea of what exactly a Buttkicker is?
Mark: A Buttkicker is a silent subwoofer. Doing exactly what a subwoofer does, letting you feel bass, but we do it silently, musically and accurately. And as a matter of fact we do a little more than a subwoofer does because we give you a direct tactile connection of your subwoofer, bass ala v-track and it brings the movies, musics, video games to life for you.
Mike: Ok, so it works off of the LFE track on the movie, or whatever you are watching or listening to.
Mark: It works off the LFE track, but it also it will also work in a stereo mode. Just simply take the bass off any sound track or to get a little more techy for the 5.1 folks, even if your speakers are set to large it will take just the LFE or if you do your subwoofer to output bass plus LFE it will do both. So really it responds to amplified signal. We go up to 200 hertz but the sweet spot is 80 hertz and below.
Mike: That is how it gets the signal but physically how does the actual Buttkicker work? Is it like a motor mechanism or what is it?
Mark: Yes, that is a really good question, Mike. And this is really the difference between us and anyone else who has ever tried this. What the Buttkicker unit is, is a patented devise, officially an electromagnetic transducer. It is a magnetically suspended piston that floats between two coils within a housing. And unlike folks who have tried tactile devises that are adapted voice coils, or speakers that have stiff plastic members that hold the mass in place, the Buttkicker’s claim to fame is that that magnet is literally floating with a magnetic spring (which to me the magnetics is alchemy). And when you introduce amplified audio signal to it that piston moves up and down, based upon the signal, and that moving mass which is now responding precisely, accurately and quickly to the signal, that moving mass (since it is encased by a housing, whatever that housing is attached to) it shakes. But the fact that it has got a magnetically suspended piston means that, first of all, it reacts instantly. Secondly there are no wear parts. We have had product buried inside the home theaters but also buried inside Disney attractions for 7-8 years running 7 days a week, 16 hours a day without any failure.
Mike: Wow! Now you have mentioned some of the other ones that are out there. So they are different? They use a different kind of driver mechanism?
Mark: Yes. To my knowledge we are the only guys who have really started from the ground up. Instead of taking a voice coil, which is really the guts of a speaker, or some kind of iso speaker transducer and used it with a direct connection tactile, we started way back when with an audio engineer and a musician saying what we really want to feel is bass. Accurately, powerfully and silently. And one of my partners, Marvin Clam, who is a Double A from Purdue, worked with a number of different speaker designs until he developed his own. So unlike a typical speaker with a spider control resonance, not resonance but to control the mass. This magnetically self centering devise is totally unique and totally different.
Mike: We are going to have to end this interview because you mentioned Purdue and I went to I.U..
Mark: Well, that’s ok. Can I say nice things about Bobby Knight for you?
Mike: Yea, sure go ahead. No I’m kidding! (Laughing). Alright, how does the Buttkicker mount to the chair? Does it mount to the chair or does it just sit underneath the chair?
Mark: As you know, we make 3 different sized Buttkickers and we make them in various types of configurations. We make them for musicians with a special mounting plate for drum throngs. We make them for gamers with an integral mount that clamps onto a center post chair. And for your audience, for the theater folks, we really offer a couple of mounting options. One, they can bolt the Buttkicker unit directly to its seat or to a riser (a lot of your folks are building risers). We just got off the phone with a guy who was putting a riser with three chairs on it. So, they can bolt that Buttkicker up or down (we call them north or south) in any spot in the chair, or riser, that it fits. Or we make a couch/chair mounting accessory which is a fancy name for very clever mounting plate that the Buttkicker bolts to. Then you slide that plate under one leg of like a 3 person sofa for example, put rubber isolators under the rest of the sofa, you can tuck the Buttkicker unit out of the way. And then, Mike, we are shaking the entire couch without touching it at all. And so if you have got a lovely spouse or a WAF (wife acceptant factor) is very high this week, and shake a fine leather piece of furniture without ever really touching it and without being seen.
Mike: And you don’t have to drill any holes in it. That is great.
Mark: Not for us.
Mike: Now you had mentioned how people are putting it under the risers. Like you said a lot of people do put risers in their home theaters. What is the preferred method? Is there a method that will give you the most shake?
Mark: Yes, that is a good question, when you say preferred method. I guess, and this is what makes home theater so much fun, sites like yours smarterhometheater.com and all the other sites a lot of fun, is you get answers from a lot of people as to what they think is best. We are kind of agnostic. In other words we take a very pragmatic approach that says, “Based upon how you need to use the product we are going to give you a solution”. Some people do like mounting Buttkickers under a riser because they can get a couple of Buttkicker units, 2 big Buttkicker LFEs, to shake 4 chairs. And they can be totally hidden out of the way. And you can get the floor under your feet shaking. On the other hand a lot of people say, you know what I want them in the seat, I recline the seat, my feet are up on the leg rest and I would rather have it in the chair. Other people say, you know I’ll make it easy for me I want to shake a whole couch. So the preferred method, as trite as it may sound, it is really how we built our company, it is really whatever you want to do we’ll help you do it. And we have had people use them every which way you can think of and a number of ways that in this lovely family show we won’t talk about.
Mike: Ok. Now what is the difference between the LFE and a mini LFE as far as performance? Is there a big performance gap if you need to go with a smaller unit?
Mark: Yes and no. Again all our units are built using the same patented technology so that they are accurate on their music and they are powerful, but that being said if you take a 4 cylinder car and you tow a trailer and you try and go up a hill, you are not going very fast. But then again, if you’ve got a little Honda Civic and a 4 cylinder engine you are fine. But if you put a 4 cylinder in a Ford pick up truck to try and tow a boat the performance is going to be lacking. So, the one big Buttkicker is probably as powerful as about 4 mini LFEs. And so again it depends on what you need. The reason we have different sizes is the same reason some people sell 15 inch subs, some people use 12 inch subs, some folks use full range speakers, some people use small. It depends upon your needs. So, certainly a big Buttkicker is much more powerful than a small Buttkicker, but that just makes sense.
Mike: Ok. Now that we have talked about the actual unit itself, the floating magnet, what accessories are required, what else do I need to make this work?
Mark: We sell our product in two different ways. We sell them in a home theater in a box like an all in one kit. Our brand new wireless Buttkicker kit, which is at www.shakemycouch.com, or our Buttkicker LFE kit (which has been out for awhile) those kits, Mike, we have taken a home theater in a box approach. It is for the person who wants the amplifier, the Buttkicker, the mounting bracket and all the interconnects and the speaker wires so that he can shake a large couch or any other thing her wants to shake. So both those, the new Buttkicker wireless kit and the Buttkicker LFE kit, are everythings included. On the other hand, for the do it yourselfers out there who are mixing and matching components, are very comfortable pulling speaker wire, and got equipment racks, they know exactly what they want, we sell our products separately. We also sell something we call ‘Quick Connect Box’ which facilitates connecting 4 Buttkicker units to one big Buttkicker amplifier to get the impendence right. So, if you don’t want to wire it series parallel it’s plug-and-play. On the other hand I’m sure a lot of your audience says look I understand series parallel, I’ve pulled plenty of wire and actually they find that kind of fun to look back at their theater and say that they did it all. We do both. We give everything in a box for the person who just wants one set of instructions and we sell components for the individual who says they are building their own theater, this is no big deal they can make anything work.
Mike: I know you mentioned that you have a wireless set up which is awesome. Anything that can eliminate wires in the home theater is a good thing I think, but for those true audio files out there I know that if you go with a wireless audio set up you do loose a little bit of fidelity when you go wireless. Is there any lose of experience if you go with the wireless versus the wired Buttkicker?
Mark: Man that is a good question. And here is what we’ve done with our wireless system. First of all since we are doing just bass and very low frequencies from a teenage day total harmonic distortion standpoint, both our wireless systems are older Buttkicker language is 900 megahertz and our new 2.4 Bluetooth wireless system is part of our new kit. Both of those have got THD that is fine for what we are doing. There is no lose of fidelity as it were. The other question though is what about delay. What is the latency of doing it wireless versus wired. And both of our wireless systems have got the latency down into the very small single digit milliseconds. You can’t tell the difference between running an RCA to your amplifier versus running the audio signal wirelessly. Both from a fidelity standpoint and a latency (or delay) system we think we have developed the system so that even the most demanding home theater aficionado or audio file will be satisfied with the results, and more than satisfied.
Mark: You had mentioned a lot of do it yourselfers, myself being one of them. I love looking at a project when I am done and having that sense of accomplishment. But if somebody is a complete do it for me kind of person, do you work with any manufacturers? I mean, can you get this factory installed? So when the guy comes and delivers their home theater seating, or what ever they are using, it is all ready to go?
Mike: Yes. A lot of your listeners will know that for years we have worked with the Berkline folks. They are a really nice company. Great folks down in Tennessee. And their distribution network are typically really knowledgeable folks and it sounds like I am giving a sales pitch (I guess I am) but I have been working for them for years and they really are good people. So if you buy Berkline Theater and specify the Buttkicker as a factor installed option. However, a lot of the other seat guys and people that you might consider higher end than Berkline (the Fortress and some of the other guys) more than Continental Seating, they are more than glad to install Buttkickers in their seat if you ask. So pretty much any type of seating option you can get a Buttkicker factory installed.
Mike: Oh, cool. Now if people want to check out some of the kits that you offer, or just get some more information about Buttkicker products, what is the best way for them to go ahead and do that?
Mark: Our main site, Mike, is www.thebuttkicker.com. Www.thebuttkicker.com has got complete information for all our products for all our markets. Our new Home Theater in a Box Wireless Buttkicker kit, which by the way is now a NASCAR licensed product for you NASCAR fans and we have a great new DVD as part of that kit called Maximum Philosophy Powered by Buttkicker. That will put together a micro site called www.shakemycouch.com.
Mike: Very cool, Mark. I have been in theaters that have the Buttkicker and I’ve got to say it definitely adds an entirely new dimension to watching a movie. I would like to take this opportunity to also remind our listeners to don’t forget to support the Smarter Home Theater Show by supporting our sponsor. Your support of them helps to support us. Just go to www.smarterhometheater.com and click on ‘Support the Show’ to learn more. And don’t forget to subscribe to our email newsletter for insider tips, cool contests and more. Just go to smarterhometheater.com and learn more. Thank you very much, Mark. And I appreciate your time.
Mark: Mike, thank you.
Mike: Alright, take care. Goodbye.
HT023 – Choosing the right Home Theater Cable
Episode #023
Host: Mike Deckys
Guest: Rick Blair – Regional Sales Manager – www.audioquest.com
Topic: Using the proper cables – Rick Blair from Audio Quest explains about using the proper cables; audio cables, video cables, digital cables, or any interconnect cable for your home theater.
Download Full Transcript here
On this episode of the Smarter Home Theater Show we welcome Rick Blair. Rick is the Regional Sales Manager, in the upper Midwest, for Audio Quest. Audi Quest is a quality manufacturer of various kinds of cables. They include interconnects, speaker cables, video and power cables. We are going to talk about how they relate to home theater and why you should use quality cables in your setups. So, I would like to take this opportunity and welcome you to the show, Rick.
Rick: Thank you very much.
Mike: On today’s episode I would like to discuss audio and video cables and why you should not go cheap on the selection of the purchase of your cables. So let me ask you, Rick, is there a big difference among all the different cable manufacturers out there?
Rick: Well, clearly, we think there is. Audio Quest was founded almost 30 years ago by our owner Bill Lowe. Who really has a passion for music and a passion for movies. I think, unlike many brands that compete for mine share and for market share in the space we have a little different culture. Bill believes that all cables are bad and some cables are less bad than others. And it is kind of a completely different philosophy I think. It is based on the premise that it is virtually impossible to connect an amplifier to a pair of speakers, for example, without the cable introducing some form of distortion. So our job is to minimize the damage or as Bill refers to it ‘We are in the damage control business.’
Mike: Okay.
Rick: There is any number of ways that any manufacturer could go about trying to address the issues that we address primarily in the time domain. Could be solid conductors versus strand conductors. It could be the geometry or the overall cross sections of how the cable is actually constructed. It could be what you use to insulate them, could be the quality of the materials that you use to terminate the cables after they are made, it could be how you terminate the cables after you made them. Make them, every single one of those ingredients, if you will, as the opportunity to introduce damage and introduce distortion in the signal path.
Mike: Okay so all these characteristics that you just spoke of, like the conductors and the geometry and the termination of the insulation that is kind of what sets the Audio Quest the higher level cables apart from a lot of the cables that you will find either on line or at some of the big box retailer stores?
Rick: Well, I think it is certainly one of the ways that we have differentiated the Audio Quest brand. I can’t really speak for the many other brands that go about their business. I can only speak to what Audio Quest does. And again I think that culturally we’ve kind of come from that top right corner of the performance versus the value and price quadrant. For many years we were strongly based in the peak of the distribution pyramid, if you will. And because of that we still have a strong and solid business in the extreme high end. We have $6500.00 meter connects and $1500.00 10 foot pairs of speaker cables as part of our regular product and platform. And I think it is because we have had that experience, and because we have had that passion and energy through the years, it has given us the ability to bring those technologies into more affordable, more mainstream distribution, more main stream price points, the other end of the product platform. We have $20.00 inter-media connects, and $40.00 HDMI cables as well. So I think it is selection, and it is also the whole value proposition. I think that the most successful people positions really cables as another component. Because, quite frankly, we find that many of our customers tell us that changing a cable will potentially has as big, or bigger, difference than changing a source component, or changing a preamplifier or changing a power amplifier. So, we are big proponents of treating cables as a component, because quite frankly no matter how good the amplifier is, if you don’t connect it with a wire to the speaker you don’t get any music.
Mike: Right. It has also been said that you can make your own cables. And some would argue that there is no noticeable difference and that there is actually kits that you can buy out there for that. What are the advantages of using a pre-manufactured cable versus a do-it-yourself kit?
Rick: Again, that comes back to the idea behind what the kit consists of, quite frankly. We have the ability to allow both our users and our dealers to terminate some of our products in the field. I think that something as silly as putting solder into the signal path, for example, the terminations on most of our cables use what we call cold weld system. What does that really mean? Well, we compress all of the air from between the connector and the conductor and create an air tight oxygen free connection. And by eliminating solder from the signal path, which is potentially another foreign material that could introduce its own sonic signature we find that it is possible to allow people to kind of custom configure their own products for their own particular room, or their own particular environment.
Mike: Okay, you said that you have some dealers and everything that can terminate their own. So they are well versed in the procedures and the proper ways to terminate a cable. Not just, like you said, take a piece of solder and some wire crimpers and solder and squeeze?
Rick: That would be true. As part of our ongoing education and communication and cooperation with our dealer community we have recurring technical bulletins and individual product presentations that are either geared towards the installation community or geared towards the sales community. We do everything we can possibly do to give people the opportunity to, you know, clearly they can buy factory terminated sets of speaker cables, and inter-connects, and quite frankly in many regards that is the best way to go. But for those do-it-yourselfers that like to do some hands on things, we can accommodate them as well.
Mike: How about do-it-yourselfers and HDMI video cables. Because I was looking on your website and I noticed that you have kind of a break down of an HDMI cable. And HDMI for those of you who are listening is a very popular transfer cable that transfers both video and audio signals, but if you really dig into it, it is not a single cable. Rather it is a collection of 19 conductors in one cable housing. And really unless you are extremely meticulous or just have a lot of spare time I don’t really think that is a do-it-yourself kind of a thing.
Rick: Well, we thought that for some time as well. And over the last two years our dealer community has consistently asked us for a solution to be able to terminate HDMI in the field. With that said sometimes you need to be careful what you ask for. You are absolutely correct there are 19 conductors inside an HDMI cable. We discovered a long time ago with our factory prepared HDMI cables that one of the easiest ways, it wasn’t easy from a manufacturing standpoint, one of the best way to improve the reliability and improve the consistency from unit to unit in an HDMI cable was instead of soldering 19 conductors onto a printed circuit board that is smaller than the width of most people thumbnails (not easy) we developed a way to basically cold weld (it is kind of a fancy way to say it’s a compression tool). Imagine a little telephone punch down block for example where when you press the conductor into the connector it cuts the insulation and again it creates an airtight oxygen connection. We found that to be less intrusive in terms of damaging the dielectric and certainly provides us a highly reliable system. In the process of developing a way to allow other people to do that it is not just the mechanical ability to potentially put a connector on to an HDMI cable. Digital HDMI is High Definition Multi-Media Interface. And you are absolutely right; it does provide a digital audio path as well as a digital video path. If you look at the core conductors it is not much different than an Ethernet cable (Category 5 or a Category 5E or a Category 6 cable) that carry the primary data packets, if you will. In the analog domain you can sent analog video over extremely long distances and still get a picture at the end.
Mike: Right.
Rick: In the digital domain, particularly in HDMI, as a transmit and receive format, there is a definite relationship between how far you can go and the difference between analog and digital (component digital, for example, compared to HDMI) when you reach the limits of the HDMI system you just get no picture at all. So, we felt that in developing a system that allowed our dealers and installers, and quite frankly it is not very user friendly, so it would not be something someone could go to a Home Depot and buy a kit and take it home and terminate their own cables. It really is not much unlike terminating an RJ45 or putting a connector on the end of a category cable, if you will. There is a tool and there is some advanced prep work and it is possible. We are not really sure how widely this technology will be accepted and used by our dealers. But in a situation where it is a new construction and you pull the factory prepared cable from Point A to Point B and the dry wallers or the painters or the electricians come in and damage the end of the cable, it is really easier to replace that connector on the end than it would be to fish a whole new cable. The time involved doing 10 or 12 or 15 of these to connect an equipment rack versus building them yourself, we just don’t think it is going to be a viable option. But some people may do it.
Mike: Now you had said with the digital video signal that once you get to a certain point there won’t be a picture at the other end unlike the analog in which you can go a great distance and you will still get a picture on the other end. I have seen some HDMI extenders, they just seem like little couplers that stick between and they are supposed to extend or repeat the signal or something. It that a viable alternative? Do they really work?
Rick: I think supposed to is probably the operative word in your question.
Mike: Okay, (laughs)
Rick: I think that although as an industry there has been a great deal of effort to try and distill what is a fairly complex technology into laymen’s terms. Although, you have to respect the efforts. Unfortunately, as in many situations, it doesn’t tell the entire story. The highest resolution digital video that is available for consumer electronics right now would either be a Blur Ray DVD or it would be a Playstation III game. The Playstation III also happens to play Blue Ray movies. The longest HDMI cable that our company makes is 20 meters, which is about 65 feet.
Mike: Okay.
Rick: We have tested 100% of these cables. We actually do 100% QC on all of our HDMI cables at the factory. And then again 100% QC on all HDMI cables that are longer than 7 and ½ meters in our distribution facility in Irvine. To basically guarantee that they will pass what is currently accepted highest resolution digital video and audio format. Which would be 1080p or 1080 progressive resolution, 24 bit color and a 60 hertz refresh rate. If any of those things change it affects the ability for you to transmit HDMI reliably over distance. So, let’s say for example, instead of using a Blue Ray, or to use a traditional satellite box, cable box, or a none Blue Ray DVD player at 1080i, or interlaced or 720 progressive, the data rate is about cut in half, which significantly increases the distance that you are able traverse with an HDMI cable. So it is trying to distill the essence of what is a very complicated format into something that can be told in a thirty second sound bite. It doesn’t work very effectively. I think what is most important for people to understand is that at 1, 2 and 3 meters HDMI cables generally offer a single cable connection instead of multiple cables. That was part of the motivation, I think, for developing the HDMI format in the first place. One cable instead of many.
Mike: Right.
Rick: Did that answer your original question?
Mike: Yes, yes that did. Thank you. I don’t want to throw a wrench into the gears here but there has been a lot of buzz here about an HDMI 1.4 which will be the next thing and that is supposedly supposed to carry your internet at well as video and data sources. Is that going to make the cable thicker? Or is that going to be an increased band width over an existing cable. Are the connector terminations and insulations, the geometry, the conductor, is all that going to be even more important as we go forward? Because you are going to have such a high band width data transfer going on?
Rick: Well, clearly those are all things that need to be considered. I think that from our perspective we’ve resubmitted the same fundamental cable designs for 1.0, 1.1, 1.2 and 1.3 certification. The standards for 1.5 and the certification process for 1.4 are just now in the process of kind of being revealed. So I think that at this point in time it is probably too early to know authoritatively. So I will have to get back to you on that one for our next episode.
Mike: That will be perfect. So I guess cables are sort of like cars that there are just a bunch of small systems that need to work well and they all need to work well together. Otherwise you are not going to get the performance that you want. It’s kind of like taking a Yugo engine and dropping it into a Ferrari. It is still going to look like a Ferrari but it is definitely not going to handle like a Ferrari.
Rick: Well, certainly there are any number of analogies that get used in the audio and video business to try and create that whole value proposition. I think if your listeners come away with anything from our conversation tonight, what I’d like them to consider is it is not possible for a cable to improve the signal path. All the cable can do is introduce distortion and damage the signal from Point A to Point B. So if you treat it as a component the objective is to find the products that introduce the least amount of damage. And as you go up and down within our produce platform we make some specific changes within the product platform that we know to do less damage.
Mike: Right. Alright Rick. Thanks for taking the time to talk to us. You know, what really hits home is when you said that cables are a component and you need to treat them that way. You know, you’ve had some customers say that changing up a cable can have as big, or bigger, difference as changing a source component. So, cables are important stuff and you really need to pay attention to it. And I would also like to remind our listeners to please support the Smarter Home Theater Show by supporting our sponsors. Your support of them helps to support us. Just go to www.smarterhometheater.com and click on ‘Support the Show’ to learn more. And please don’t forget to subscribe to our email newsletter for insider tips, cools contests and more. Just go to www.smarterhometheater.com and learn more. So, again thanks for taking the time and if somebody wants to learn more about the Audio Quest brand and the variety of cables that you offer, what is the best way for them to do that?
Rick: Our website is a wealth of knowledge, www.audioquest.com. And they are certainly welcome to open email dialogue with me or any of my colleagues. I am one of six regional sales managers across the country. And we have about a thousand selling locations in the United States and many of out dealers are located on our ‘Dealer Locator’ on the website. There also a very good tool to get your questions answered.
Mike: Alright, great, thanks so much taking the time tonight.
Rick: Mike thanks for the opportunity and I look forward to speaking to you again soon.
